CERN Cows and strong magnets

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penguin42
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CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by penguin42 » Wed Nov 18, 2009 6:32 pm

I remember seeing a rather odd article last year where someone had analysed google satellite imagery and found that cows tend to align north/south and it was suggested that the reason was that they were gently sensitive to the earths magnetic field.

Given the LHC is built under a lot of farm land and there is a very strong magnet, is the field detectable at the surface and if so has anyone looked to see if it influences the orientation of the cows?

(OK so this is about LHC so perhaps it's not off-topic, but heck it didn't feel right putting this odd a guestion under the Physics topic...)

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Xymox
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by Xymox » Wed Nov 18, 2009 7:27 pm

I remember that story ! That was great fun !

You know... You have a point...

But that brings up another point. Does the LHC radiate and residual magnetic energy ? EMI ? RFI ?

What does the LHC emit ?

And of course. Do cows respond..

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by chriwi » Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:39 am

This article seems to be somewhat esoteric, especially when he writes that the soul woud be drawn to the postulated anti-gravity-gun and that with the soul also god would die.
Sounds not veryreasonable to me.

Also the idea to explain the gravity onlyby a magnetic field coming from electronsand their number in an atom does not seem to make sence to me because different isotopes of one leement containig different numbersof neutrons but the same nunmber of protonsand electronsshold have the same gravity, but the mass and the weight caused by gravity also dependson the number of neutrons.

Sorry when I am wrong and this is resolved loater in the article but I did not habe the time to read it all.

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chriwi
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by chriwi » Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:58 pm

I already mentioned that I did not read the whole article (I actually only read 5 pages including the first 2 pages and the last) that seemed to be enough for me to see that there is no proof.
Besides that I never print texts comming from the internet only to read them.

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by drippingwet rat » Thu Nov 26, 2009 5:07 am

so if the system got haywired for a couple of minutes would the cows float off the ground as in a negative mag. versis a positive ,or would just face the other direction .if this is true you could mess with the cows big time

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by Xymox » Thu Nov 26, 2009 5:13 am

Hahahaha.... Welll...... Its worthy of a study... "The effects on bovines from LHC magnetic fields"...

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Tau
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by Tau » Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:23 pm

Actually, the alignment of cows is quite well-studied.
Cows stand with their rear end into the wind.
(Since I live in the Netherlands, I can tell you that indeed is the case from my own experience.)
The reason is likely to be that they have to burp quite often (due to the complex bacterial digestion system they use) and that seems to be harder upwind.
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by spencer » Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:45 pm

got cow data ?
We might be able to build a cowmeter.

there has to be EMI/RFI from the power lines a least.

(sorry, you guys lay this stuff on me before i get my coffee)

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by March_Hare » Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:06 pm

Sheep tend to stand with their rears in the wind as well. When I was a student I lived for several years in a place with lots of sheep around, so I had ample chance to observe their behavior.

Anyway...
1. The study penguin42 refers to mentions cows standing predominantly in the North-South direction (in various European countries), whereas the main direction of the wind is afaik from the West here.

2. From what I read about it, I am not sure if the cows were found to be aligned with the magnetic N-S line or the geographic one.

3. I understand that the researchers were basically too lazy to go out into the field, and so they stayed indoors and observed mainly ... hi-rez satellite pictures. :scared-eek:

Now that's what I call science! If all this is true, the data do not rule out the possiblity that the cows were influenced by the satellite that took the pics...
/sarcasm off

@Drippingwet rat: you're confusing gravity and magnetism

And back to the OP and possibly the cow meter: since the magnets are located quite a bit underground, are their fields even noticeable on the surface? (NB: it is quite simple to test this with a compass.)
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by chriwi » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:54 pm

If the presence of hte satellite might have influenced the orintation of the cows the presence of a human spectator might have as well or even more.
But this question comes cloes to quantum physics, where it is consense that certain properties of a system are just not specified as long as nobody or nothing is watching them.
Maybe also the cows have no orientation at al as long as nobody is watching. :think:

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by tswsl1989 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:44 pm

:o So if position is affected by observation, what are the odds of looking at a cow and getting burgers? :happy-jumpyellow:

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by Tau » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:17 am

This is a clear example of the reverse of that principle:
here, observation depends on position:
  • If you look at a cow and you are at MacDonald's, you probably see a burger.
  • If you are in a restaurant, you probably see a beef steak.
  • And if you are in a farm, you see a wind meter.
The quantum mechanical consequences of this are so deep, I leave them to experts like MagneticTrap.
:?
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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by tswsl1989 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:25 am

I'll admit that I'm curious about the effect of the uncertainty principle in this situation. :D

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Re: CERN Cows and strong magnets

Post by March_Hare » Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:44 pm

... let's not forget the state the observer is in (hungry, vertigo, etc.), and whether someone is observing the observer or not...
:rolleyes:
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